Oblivion talk:Amulet of Kings

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I edited this page considerable. Please forgive me as there are many names I cannot remember (the dragon god for one...), and as such I left the stub attachment on the page. Please improve on what I wrote, as I know little of the Amulet's history, and this is one of the most important items in the main quest of Oblivion. --Joshua Boniface 00:18, 29 August 2006 (EDT)

I am currently working on the Lore:Amulet of Kings article (yet to be posted), and will transclude the data pertinent to such in Oblivion once it is complete (say, in a week or so). That much aside, you have done a nice job on the article. There is some data that is ambiguous (and some that is wrong), however, it is of little import, as the overall effect is superb. Good work!

Oh, also, the "dragon god" is Akatosh.

-- Booyah boy 00:53, 29 August 2006 (EDT)

I added some history I remember reading somewhere. I'm new and still struggle with editing, but could someone add some more links if they feel like some are missing? -- Anonymous 17:06, 30 June 2007 (EDT)

-- Anonymous 21 November 2007

Considering the fact that the Amulet must have been worn by an Heir of the first Queen through the centuries, it could be interesting if anyone had noticed any apperance of it in history. I especially wonder where it has been during the long the period between the end of the First Era and the beginning of the second one, When the Akaviri potentate ruled the empire

Contents 1 RefID & Wearing 2 Not a glitch 3 Using Amulet of Kings 4 Doesn't make sense. 5 re:using amulet of Kings

[edit] RefID & Wearing

The RefID for the Amulet of Kings is 000250A0. If you go into the console and type "player.additem 000250A0 1" and then "player.equipitem 000250A0 1" you are able to wear it. --24.2.195.160 15:57, 22 July 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Not a glitch

Anonymous user 212.238.240.215 posted this on the main page:

During the main quest: Dagon Shrine, Mankar Camoran can be seen wearing the amulet, which means he should be a Septim (which is most unlikely).

Quoting directly from Wikipedia:

"It is unknown how Mankar Camoran was able to wear the Amulet of Kings, since only those of Dragon blood can wear it. However, it is said in the Making of Oblivion Documentary, that Mankar Camoran is descended from another line of Princes, and is trying to claim Tamriel for them. This may provide insight as why he can wear the Amulet of Kings."

[edit] Using Amulet of Kings

Is there a possible way to wear, keep, and drop the Amulet of Kings? And is it a Daedric artifact? (This is for Xbox 360) Added by: Cloud strife

(question was moved here after originally being posted at UESPWiki:Reference Desk)

No, it is not supposed to be an item that the player uses. As for whether or not it's an artifact, we've chosen not to add it to the page Oblivion:Artifacts because it is not a useful item to the player. See the discussion at Oblivion_Talk:Artifacts#New Criteria, for example. Even ignoring its usefulness, it would not be categorized as a Daedric artifact, because it was not created by one of the Daedric Princes. If anything, it would be categorized as an Aedric artifact, because it was created by the Aedra Akatosh. --Nephele^Talk 17:25, 31 December 2007 (EST)

Does all this therefore mean the Amulet doesn't have an ID number to enable you to drop it?

The reason Mancar may weild the Amulet of Kings is because he is in HIS paradise realm, which HE is in control of certain things, ie: being able to wear the Amulet of Kings.

[edit] Doesn't make sense.

The whole plot surrounding the Amulet is swiss cheese, from a plot consistency perspective.

1. Alessia wasn't a Septim. She was the one who made the covenant with Akatosh.

2. The Remans weren't Septims. They possessed the Amulet for most of its existence, and apparently it worked just fine.

3. Tiber Septim found the amulet in Reman III's tomb at Sancre Tor. So what?

4a. No mention is made of the Dragonfires prior to the Oblivion quest arc, in any literature, ever.

4b. The Dragonfires would have failed during the Akaviri Interregnum as well, and no mention is made of that.

5. Martin is also not a Septim, as in fact most of the Septim rulers were descended from Tiber Septim's brother, Agnorith. Tiber Septim's bloodline died with Pelagius I, his immediate heir, who died childless. Every ruler from Kintyra merely took the name of Septim, to legitimize their claim to Tiber Septim's legacy. They are not his descendants, and therefore do not possess "the blood of Tiber Septim".

6. Uriel IV wasn't even descended from Agnorith: his mother was a Septim's queen, and his father was a commoner. He was only a Septim by legality, not blood. Yet there is no mention of the Amulet or the Dragonfires failing him.

Given these facts, why can't the Player Character wear the Amulet?

From a lore perspective, Oblivion's core story is Doubleplus Epic Fail. --70.131.55.20 14:40, 14 April 2008 (EDT)

Wait, let me get this straight. You are rating an entire videogame's storyline as "Epic Fail", because of a few, extremely minor developer oversights that hardly anyone would ever notice, and even fewer would give a care? You have some unrealistically high standards. --Darth NANAME 18:17, 20 May 2008 (EDT)

Hi. I wrote the above. So let me get this straight. You think it's a "minor developer oversight" that the entire basis of the story for this video game is logically inconsistent, and cannot be true even standing by itself, much less by all the previous lore of the Elder Scrolls? You may not be aware that Oblivion is the 4th game of the series, and there is already a well-established backstory which predates it, and which the story told in Oblivion completely contradicts in every way. You're absolutely right. It's unrealistic for me to expect a game to make sense. You win. --76.202.248.34 08:37, 11 December 2008 (EST)

I agree with Darth NANAME, and this is why:

• Alessia wasn't a Septim indeed, but the Septims are her heirs, according to the book about the Amulet.
• The Septims are the only ones who can wear the Amulet Today. Nobody ever claimed that the amulet couldn't be worn by others in the past.
• Why aren't the Dragonfires ever mentioned? Nobody knows their power, exept for the Emperor, as is hinted and told by Jauffre and Baurus during the Main Quest.
• The Septims had septim blood only in formality? Tiber and Agnorith were brothers! Agnorith's last name was also 'septim'!
• Martin not a Septim? Martin isn't descended from Uriel IV, but from Cephorus II, who had Septim blood, being a ligitimate child of Cassynder.

How is that for a 'Doubleplus Epic Fail'? -- LordDagon 11:29, 28 June 2008 (EDT)

In what way are the Septims "Alessia's heirs" ? "A book told me so" is not an answer. Hjalti Early-Beard (Tiber Septim's actual name and identity as a Nord) is in no way related to Alessia or the Remans, and the Remans are also in no way related to Alessia. Martin is also in no way related to Hjalti Early-Beard.

By what logic can you propose that the rules of the Amulet change with time? By whose whim? By what mechanism? The game does in fact strictly state that the Amulet can only be worn by someone with Septim blood, which excludes even those people in the game who end up wearing it: Martin and Mankar Camoran. You can hardly deny that the developers simply ignored everything they were telling the player while fashioning the main quest.

A brother of Tiber Septim is not of Tiber Septim's blood. Tiber Septim is the dynast, not his father. Agnorith's last name was not, in fact, Septim. Septim was a name assumed by Tiber, and was not his family name. RTFL before you comment.

Please explain to me why you think Cephorus II was a "ligitimate" child of Cassynder? Why would Cassynder disinherited him in favor of Uriel Lariat if that were the case? You're making up lore to explain faults of lore. Cephorous II actually has no known relation to Agnorith, and certainly no relation to Tiber Septim.

You also fail to account for the Akaviri Interregnum, which was all of the Second Era. You could at least have tried to make something up. Perhaps Versidue-Shaie was also an "heir of Alessia" ? He was from another continent, but that doesn't seem to matter to you.

So yeah, I'd say that's pretty good for a doubleplus epic fail. Thanks for contributing. Thanks for nothing. --76.202.248.34 08:37, 11 December 2008 (EST)

Well done. Oblivion's plot may well be doubleplus epic phail, but there are answers to all your questions, who can wear the AoK and who can't and why, as well as its true origin and purpose. As the KotN prophet says: "There is truth in the blood, but it is no the truth you seek." I can't explain it all very well here, but a search on the Bethsoft lore forum would answer. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Temple-Zero (talk • contribs) on 27 July 2008.

I am the one who brought this to the attention of the Bethsoft lore forum. Last time I looked for responses there were none that were coherent. Quite simply, the only answer is "the game was rushed and the plot doesn't make sense as a result". It can't be retconned into being good unless one discards most of TES lore along with it. --76.202.248.34 08:37, 11 December 2008 (EST)

Hey, be nice. Also, I'm not sure if Mankar Cameron did wear it, or if he just held it. Plus, if you're in your own world of your own making, it is quite possible that you can do whatever you want. --Timmeh ^Talk 08:56, 11 December 2008 (EST)

Perhaps we should all take a moment to consider this: It's a game, the operative word here being GAME. It is supposed to be fun, not real life. If it were real life, it would involve going to work in a small, grey cube of an office, and wishing 5 PM would come sooner. The main concept of "fantasy role-playing" is escapism. Having the ability to immerse yourself in a completely different world, and getting to mash some monster with a hammer. That is how it should be played> Instead of thinking: "Mankar Camoran can't wear that because he's not a Spetim and neither was <insert name here> because apparently some other IMAGINARY character died before having kids" Try thinking this: "wow cool there's this wizard chap who is evil and I am going to have to kill him with my big axe." Auguil 19:23, 14 July 2009 (UTC)

[edit] re:using amulet of Kings

I can't remeber what level exactly,but if you recieve the spelldrinker amulet(mages guild) at the correct level,it will appear like the amulet of kings.

It is level 15+ and you recieve it when you reach Evoker rank.Go to the Spelldrinker Amulet page for more info. Enjoy --Prince of Madness 00:31, 10 July 2008 (EDT)

Arnora's Amulet, obtained during the quest Two Sides of the Coin, is a very close match. The "True" version is almost identical save the eight gems around the rim and brighter color. It can also be enchanted (and thus renamed). 76.27.253.80 01:26, 14 December 2008 (EST)